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Thread: For NBA fans

  1. #1241

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    Also, irving thinks the earth is flat. Addition by subtraction.

    Brooklyn traded their best player for a PG that is arguably worse than their current PG who was their 2nd best player. They might be worse next year than they were this year.

  2. #1242

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    Here's my take.

    So Kyrie + LeBron was not as good as the warriors. They were not going to compete against the warriors in 17/18 and they were not going to improve the roster without clearing cap space. They plateaued.

    Luckily, Kyrie decided for some reason he was too good to live in the shadow of the king despite never being able to win on the cavs in games where LeBron sat (lol superstar my ass). In fact I think the record with LeBron sitting was something stupid like to 4-18 and in the playoffs against the warriors, when lebron was on the bench, the cavs were completely and utterly trash.

    Anyways. Back to the trade. So the cavs manage to shed Kyrie's contract and acquire cheap contracts who, combined, are worth more then Kyrie In terms of wins added and cost less for 1 season. This gives the cavs a ton more cap flexibility next year if they want to make trades and raise their ceiling for a run at the warriors. Realistically, they won't compete with the warriors regardless, but they have a higher ceiling next year then they would have had with Kyrie alone. So the cavs get better next year arguably, and they get better in following years potentially (If LeBron stays) because they get a potential #1 pick. A potential #1 pick isn't just "some rookie pg".

    The cherry on top is they manage to do all of this for a guy who had confirmed he was not going to participate in training camp because he did not want to play on the team anymore. Paul George, a player I consider much better then Irving, was traded in a similar situation for next to nothing.

    The cavs are massive winners in this trade.

    As for Boston... well they get a young talented player for more assets then he should have cost them after hoarding those assets and missing out on Jimmy Butler/Paul George. This is a win for the celtics if you believe in Irving and the young talent already in place behind him (Tatum, smart, fultz, brown) but its a costly victory and they're putting too much faith in a guy who thinks the world is flat. I don't think the Celtics are going to beat the cavs with Kyrie now, and I don't think the Celtics are gonna beat Philly in the future without Marvin Bagley or Micheal Porter.

  3. #1243

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    The Cavs aren't winners beyond this year is what I think you're missing. I'm looking at long term and you're looking at "can they compete with the warriors" this year.

    They're literally about to be in the same boat after the first time James left. Drafting a new corner stone for the franchise while trying to fight for an 8 seed at best and James winning championships somewhere else.

  4. #1244

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    The future wasn't there with Irving anyways. The team has a lot of bad contracts and only by keeping James would they be relevant in the future. The Cavs managed to trade a toxic situation (Irving apparently was willing to sit out training camp) and turned it into Isaiah Thomas (a defensive sieve that can score on anybody) and Jae Crowder (Prototypical 3 and D wing) on a cheap contract that can help them win or let them trade him for more assets.

    They also acquired the Brooklyn pick, which some people believe to be the most valuable asset currently for next year. They also have Kevin Love who they can trade as well because he still has some value and his contract is 20/million a year, vs 25-30 million a year some other players make.

    The future isn't bleak for Cleveland. If LeBron leaves then they would suck anyways. Now they have a lot more flexibility to rebuild for the future while being competitive this year. Kyrie Irving wasn't going to change that. Cleveland wasn't designed for him, maybe Boston will be.

  5. #1245

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    Exactly. And also, I don't know why anyone is assuming LeBron is leaving cleveland. That's hardly a done deal, but it's not a horrible situation there at all. Especially now that they have the Brooklyn pick.

  6. #1246

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    The entire point is that you'll be out of LeBron James and Thomas. If they trade KLove, great. But it's the entire principal of them having to rebuild all over again. If they were actually concerned with their future they wouldn't have been strong handed by LeBron about personnel. Irving was doing fine in Cleveland before LeBron. In a post 2017-18 season for Cleveland they're left with Crowder, Love and some dudes if LeBron does not decide to stay. I'm not saying it's a forgone conclusion but if you aren't preparing for that in full then it's a mistake.

    I don't think Cleveland wins big in the trade because you're downgrading in PG, you get a very affordable Crowder and a pick. Draft picks are only good if the player who is drafted pans out. Until then their value is subjective.

  7. #1247

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    I cant think of a more reasonable alternative man. Even if u keep Kyrie this year, I would argue that I'd rather have Crowder and Thomas for 2018 then Kyrie. And then what do u have? In your situation LeBron leaves regardless of what you do and now you have a disgruntled Kyrie + Love and no 1st round picks to dream on. Kyrie + Love doesn't even guarantee a playoff spot and trading kyrie's bird rights next year essentially makes you the bulls. You're basically either the bulls if you decide to trade Kyrie next year after LeBron leaves or the Knicks if you decide to rebuild around Kyrie and Love. I know I would be much more comfortable having the first round pick then relying on Kyrie and Love to keep my team competitive.

  8. #1248

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    Essentially what you're saying is the rebuild is inevitable right? So wouldn't a potential first overall pick and a chance at going all in for 1 more year before the rebuild be exactly what you want?

  9. #1249

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    I like the trade for the Celtics more. Irving is better and younger than IT and I think he'll be even better next season because he'll be more relaxed playing with the Celtics and Stevens than he would have with the Cavs. In my view the Cavs/LeBron is what is toxic here, and I think Irving just wanted to get away from that, even if it meant being on a worse team.

  10. #1250

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    Lebron's toxic like mj was toxic. The cavs ownership is toxic like bulls ownership.

    Kyrie is just a loser who got his way by stirring up some drama. The Celtics aren't going anywhere with him leading the way.

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