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  1. #21


    Quote Originally Posted by |AFO| View Post
    @Spence: Derozen made a huge leap in his game this year, didn't he? If he could get a consistent 3, he'd be a dominant 2 guard. If he works on that in the off season I could see him in the top 20. Lowry doesn't have as much potential IMO. He's good at everything, but I don't think he has the athleticism to take it to the next level. No one seems to agree with me on that. Watching Derozen destroy people though... He's got a great first step, speed, quickness, power. Just have to get that 3 down and defenses are going to be on their heels the whole game.
    From what I can tell, Derozan can't handle the playoffs. He's upped his game every single year he's been a raptor (regular season) and is an amazing person/hard worker, but I think his skill is pretty capped and predictable. He gets shut down in the playoffs due to the refs swallowing the wistle and defensive intensity goes up. Even if the 3 point jumper comes, his basketball IQ is extremely questionable (probably the most iso heavy player in the league and definitely isn't kobe), and his defense is worse then James Harden. As for Lowry, u kinda hit the nail on the head, he's the perfect complementary player at PG. He can score, he can dish, he plays elite defense for his position, he has an extremely high basketball IQ, he makes so many hustle plays, he's big in the clutch and I can't tell u how many times he's killed other teams runs by putting the team on his back and making a big play on either end of the court. I'd rather have lowry as a second option scorer then almost anyone in the league honestly. I have to agree with u Lowry lacks the athleticism and shooting to be a superstar/#1 option, but in terms of everything he brings as a 2nd option.. let's just say if I were Durant, I'd rather play on the raptors then OKC. Westbrook is basically the kobe to durant's jordan and it's an imperfect match. Lowry + CO would be better suited to get durant a ring imo.

    That being said, if I were Durant, I'd probably look at the Celtics over any team. They have everything ready for a superstar like Durant to come in and push them over top. On top of that, they have a ton of trade chips in hand to add even more then just durant.

    Could u imagine a team like this?

    PG: Smart, IsiahThomas (still the 6th man)
    SG: Avery Bradley, SG/SF Draft pick
    SF: Durant, Crowder
    PF: Amir Johnson, Kelly Olynyk
    C: Boogie Cousins, Jared Sullinger

    PF is a bit of a weakness, but Amir Johnson and Olynyk are both big enough to play center/switch with boogie anytime and both crowder and durant are big enough to play PF and switch with eachother if the team wants to play small. Bradley and smart are elite defenders at PG or SG and Isiah Thomas comin in to bail out smart or avery when they struggle offensively is crucial. It's pretty cool that this is even possible, certainly still wouldn't compete with the cavs offensively (I think the cavs are showing in the playoffs the potential of that lineup) but defensively it would rival the spurs. Brad Stevens would be in heaven with all the potential lineups and matchups and I'm a big Brad Stevens supporter.

    Im not as die hard a raptors fan as I am a basketball fan so I'd be pretty stoked if the celts pull something like that off. It's gonna be a HUGE offseason for the celts or Raps or both.

    Unfortunately, I think the raps won't mess with the status quo and will keep Derozan around. Nothin wrong with that, I just think the raps need more then Derozan to compete with the cavs next year and I definitely don't see Durant coming. If the raps manage to take down the heat this year, I also don't think they stand much of a chance against the cavs. Batum+ a solid PF, IMO would make this team (Ranked 11th in defensive efficiency with Scola at PF and Derozan at SG) would be a powerhouse defensively and probably would still be at least a top 10 offense with some potential to be better then that pending some ball movement improvements.

  2. #22


    Also this: Is the Cavs offense on par or better then the GSW offense? I think it's starting to become a conversation.

  3. #23
    Senior Member manonfire101's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005


    Nope. Golden State's offense is better.

    Curry is ridiculous. Seriously, what do you even say at this point? The guy is fucking incredible.

  4. #24
    I'm the Duke of Spook! KBHoleN1's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2003


    17 points in the OT period? Most in NBA history, regular season or playoffs. Incredible.

  5. #25
    They all float down here. The Butcher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Philadelphia, PA.


    You'd have to be a serious hater to be unable to appreciate his talents and work ethic.

  6. #26


    Quote Originally Posted by Greendaybum5 View Post
    @Spence Lowry is a legit PG, but not top 5....Off top of my head 1) Curry 2) Westbrook 3) CP3 4) Lillard 5) Wall then I may even put Irving ahead of him. Once Teague is out of ATL or Schroder goes to the Sixers (one can dream ATL pulls the trigger) then Schroder is going to rise quickly too, but obviously he's not anywhere near the level of these guys yet.
    I think Lillard is debateable, but at this point I'd definitely take lowry over Wall and Irving.

    My argument is this: Do you believe Lillard, Wall or Irving can carry a team to a championship? If not then Lowry is your guy. Lillard probably could be the #1 option on a championship team, but it's close, and his defense is so bad that he needs to be hidden completely. Wall needs a jumpshot and some better players around him (to me he's a pg who needs better players around him to shine, reminds me of Rondo in his prime, but probably better offensively) before I give him a nod, and irving is lillard light.

    In terms of raw talent, Lowry probably isn't top 10, but Lowry is easily the most reliable and solid pg of the bunch behind CP3. It's a damn shame he's been so bad in the playoffs consistently, because he's the main reason the raps won 56 games this year. Granted, the last two years the raps have been good because of the weak east, but this year Kyle was one of the best players in the entire NBA (not saying he is in terms of talent, but he was one statistically)

    Think about it like this.

    Here's our roster:

    SG= Derozan: breakout season for him offensively, can't shoot threes and was one of the worse defensive players in the entire league
    SF= James Johnson/terrence ross/Norm Powell: Carroll was out for most of the season injured and casey just played the matchups at this position. James Johnson is barely a player in this league, Terrence Ross is so inconsistent it hurts and Norm Powell played like 15 games at the end of the season because he was in the D league
    PF= Luis fucking Scola? Learned how to shoot 3s, but was terrible both offensively and defensively.
    C= Jonas Valanciunas: Started season looking like a beast, kobe broke his hand, came back and didn't look the same until way late and then completely broke out in the playoffs. Offensively and Defensively for most of the season JV was probably middle of the pack in terms of big men
    6th man= Cory Joseph: Played SG beside kyle lowry for the most part in small ball lineups because derozan is so bad on defence. Defensively and offensively he was avg.
    Backup PF= 2pat: Draymond Green SUPER light. Defensively, probably our best option at PF, but struggles to get rebounds. He had a down year offensively.
    Backup C= Biyombo: Defensively a monster, gets rebounds. Offensively complete train wreck.

    What about that entire roster tells u that it's a 56 win team? Kyle Lowry was brilliant and is underrated. Is there a reason we had a top 5 offense beyond kyle lowry? No. Same thing with the defense. How does a roster with derozan + ross on the wing (Train wreck defenders most nights) and Luis Scola/JV starting become a top 10 defense? Kyle lowry.

    Kyle Lowry > Everything
    Last edited by Spencer 555; 05-10-2016 at 12:04 PM.

  7. #27


    Quote Originally Posted by Spencer 555 View Post
    I think Lillard is debateable, but at this point I'd definitely take lowry over Wall and Irving.
    Lowry is significantly older than those 3 and isn't really better at all. Definitely wouldn't take him over them

  8. #28


    Quote Originally Posted by Lex View Post
    Lowry is significantly older than those 3 and isn't really better at all. Definitely wouldn't take him over them
    Of course not if we're talking dynasty. This year tho, Lowry was probably the #4 or 5 pg.

    Next year, I'd probably take lowry as well unless Lillard can take another step forward. A healthy Lowry should be able to replicate what he did this year. If this playoff lowry is the new lowry moving forward you obviously have to pick Lillard.

    Long term, I think Wall is the best of the bunch. Only thing missing from Wall's game is a reliable jump shot and a remotely decent squad around him. That Wizards team is fucking terrible and Wall is obviously a play maker. Can't really make his teammates better if they consistently miss the open shots he gives them lol. I hope he reaches his potential, but I don't know if he will. He looked distraught at times this year and Paul Pierce didn't like him (Paul Pierce's opinion is pretty much gospel to me).

  9. #29


    Man such a joke loss by the raptors. Their shot selection is retarted, always the deep 2 man. Jv bailed them out before but now they're fucked. And derozans so inconsistent

  10. #30


    Quote Originally Posted by manonfire101 View Post
    Nope. Golden State's offense is better.

    Curry is ridiculous. Seriously, what do you even say at this point? The guy is fucking incredible.
    first unanimous MVP is a nice touch to his CV at this point

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